The E-commerce Leader

[00:00:00] Jason: the single biggest mistake we see people make is not investing in profit focused education and learning more, for their own management ability in their business.
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[00:01:17] Intro: Hey folks, welcome back to the e-commerce leader podcast. The place to be for those who want to be the best e-commerce leader they can be. And we’re here to get you there. So today we’re in the middle of helpful lessons from the profit habits workshop, which Jason recently ran with Kyle Heymach, his business partner in the coaching consulting side.
[00:01:37] And with Zack Martin, the CPS. Who is also now an e-commerce business owner and the insights they brought were interesting because they’re kind of more psychological in nature that I would say then than tactical financial things, but all the more important to hear for all that, because it comes from real life.
[00:01:54] This is not a theory discussion today. This is a discussion, a reflection on real life and, and how we can as business owner operators. Come to become my guess, at least come to terms with, come to be friends with, come to, even in the end, embrace operating with financial literacy and how we get there and how we you know, make friends with our numbers.
[00:02:14] So you find this episode intriguing and interesting as we did to record it. And thanks in advance for listening.
[00:02:20] Michael: I would say just to put a more positive or just to spin, but a more positive relationship to sort of financial insight. I would say I’m personally, even though my personal financial measurement is a bit messy and I’m working on it and I’m in conversation with some people to, to see, you know, to get the books in order, I’m still very, very excited conceptually by it.
[00:02:40] And I, I absolutely believe I’m in solid ground there. And here’s why, because I think it’s not just about survival and you are. Absolutely right. If you’re not solid doing your numbers right now in e-commerce right now with physical products, but also probably, you know, other things will come at us, economically over the next couple of years, we’re in interesting times as the Chinese curse says.
[00:02:58] But it’s not just defensive it’s it’s. If you understand the, the numbers, you can pull leavers that are quite strong movements, but safely, because you understand it’s like a racing driver knows how to drive into a corner, 180 miles an hour. It’s perfectly safe. Whereas they will break down to 20 miles an hour for another corner because that’s the safe speed.
[00:03:17] And they have that expertise and judgment to know what to say. Speed is. And I, my, my feeling. Very strongly from the businesses that will run financially, that I’ve worked with. You maybe have other weaknesses that I helped them with, but they have really a solid feel of fitting a safety and knowing how hard they can drive the business without going off the track.
[00:03:34] And that’s an amazing positive growth spurt thing. I mean, the business I’ve seen blow up most has got the best possible numbers. I mean, there’s, there’s no coincidence there that I’ve worked with the business. They came in with two and a half million pounds a month or something, and they’re in their best months.
[00:03:48] And they went out with, you know, like, sorry, no, about 250,000 pounds. I mean, they went out with about two and a half million. It was just a, you know, a hundred percent doubling each year for three or four years in a row. And, and they had the best CFO and the most clarity on the numbers as well as all the other entrepreneurial things, creativity risk-taking but very judged risk-taking.
[00:04:06] So for me, there’s a. And excitement about that, that I, if we could perhaps get people to buy into more, they would be more invested in education about profit, I guess. Yeah. Anyway, I’m running, referencing on here. What’s what’s the next insight that you’ve got that, that you think people need from the
[00:04:22] Jason: workshop?
[00:04:23] Yeah, this one’s really interesting and hopefully it’s an encouragement to everybody. Hopefully we’re this, isn’t just a list of negativity today, but this one I think is an encouragement. And that’s the fact that I think what I’ve realized through doing this focus on profit, you know, the training and the, all these conversations is that, it’s pretty rare for people to have a financial or business mentor and.
[00:04:45] Most people are in a vacuum of their own thinking. And just, I guess you could say an isolation of them and their QuickBooks account and their, you know, Stripe account PayPal account or whatever it is. And it was like, how do I figure this out? And what, what I’ve come to realize, and really appreciate to be honest is the fact that cinnamon and I started our work on eBay together in 2006.
[00:05:09] 2008 and we’ve always done it together. So there was two people who could always, you know, if I had a question about the number, she’d look at it. If she had interesting insights in the number of questions and we talk about it and we, we basically took the best and, you know, kind of the thinking and iron sharpens iron, I guess.
[00:05:26] And then then early on, I guess it was probably 2010 or so. I started meeting weekly with my, you know, mentor, Ron, we go to breakfast every Saturday morning and we talk about business stuff every week and he’s run, you know, a low margin business for 30 years and done incredibly well. And so I didn’t realize how unique, I guess, or special that really actually was until I, you know, started to talk to other people about these topics.
[00:05:56] And they’re like, well, I don’t have anybody to talk to. And. And, and so there you go. I mean, I think that’s, that’s sort of an interesting insight and, and I would just encourage everybody figure out how to find a local business mentor, somebody you can meet with, even if they’re just, you know, even if it’s not perfect, you know, because no one is perfect, no relationship is perfect.
[00:06:20] But if there’s someone who has been in business for a long time and they have the mental and emotional energy to meet with you regularly, if you buy them coffee and they have time in their life to do it, maybe they’re a retiree or something like that. Meet with them, ask them questions, hear their stories, learn from their stories and, and put hypotheticals in front of them and see what they say.
[00:06:41] Maybe there’ll only be right. 60% of. But if you overlap that thinking with what you know to be true and you can integrate it into what your situation is, you’ll be infinitely more, you know, solid in terms of your thinking. It really is, a, you know, there’s a wisdom in a multitude of counselors type situation and getting one is, I think it should be a priority, I think for every, e-commerce operator.
[00:07:05] And that would be the first thing would be business mentor. And that’s, again, that’s not a paid thing or anything like that. That’s a, that’s just a, a friend or a, you know, kind of a local acquaintance that you could say, you know, I have somebody who I can speak to about hard challenges in my business. So I, I think that’s a really, important thing for people to think about and to, to look into.
[00:07:26] Yeah, I’d
[00:07:26] Michael: agree with that. And I would differentiate participates, which really could be paid in the same person, but it could well be that you pay a coach or a consultant and you have a mentor, which is rather different. I, I would, I’m not use the word mentor on my site. I’m decided that I’m going to change that recent.
[00:07:39] I haven’t changed it yet to mess with the URLs and things, but for people who are starting out those inappropriate words, but I’m now I’m working with people who are already into revenue and profits. The instant thing, what my, probably my, one of my most successful clients at the moment. Really often we just, you know, he says I’ve been sitting there your thoughts, and sometimes he’s wise enough to not say anything as I’d want to know your thoughts first.
[00:08:00] I don’t want to tell you what I’m thinking. Okay. Okay. If you want to do it that way, sometimes I will do the other way. And then I’ll say, yeah, you’re thinking the same stuff I did. I just wanted to check. So a lot of bits of reality check is just like, am I going crazy? Or this feels like X is that makes sense.
[00:08:11] It does. And then I’d add this, this, this nuance. So it’s just having a reality check and having a way to refine your thoughts. The other experience I have with people, especially, and you must have this, a lot of Jason, but when somebody comes on the call with you and they haven’t had a consultant before, and they’d been operating their business and they’ve maybe got a small team, but it’s basically them.
[00:08:29] It’s like a sort of rush of stuff. They just get off their. And I, I, I did this with you when you were my consultant slash mentor. And after about 15, 20 minutes, they started to sort their own problems because they’ve had a chance to articulate it. And once they’ve heard somewhere, well, it’s not just that it’s, this, it is kind of emotional catharsis sometimes like, oh my goodness.
[00:08:48] But then sometimes it’s just hearing your own voice making sense of this stuff. People reflect back to you what you said, and then you think, oh yeah, you know what? I think I’ve found my own solution, which is not the same process as a mental, by the way. But I would, I guess it’s another thing, isn’t it that,
[00:09:01] Jason: well, we should talk through that.
[00:09:02] The difference between a mentor that is local to you and a paid coach or consultant. And, and I, I would make a big distinction between those two because you and I are both in the coaching consulting industry, for e-commerce and, but, but a local mentor is different in my mind. And here just a few obvious nuances, a local mentor you may meet with and talk to in person that’s very different.
[00:09:27] Virtual relationship, a local mentor is someone who you don’t pay for their advice. In my view, it, you don’t, and, and there’s there’s opportunity and op and value there. The reason it’s interesting to me, for it to be somebody who just have as a friend, level conversation is, they have to be sufficiently motivated intrinsically in their own, right?
[00:09:47] And their own mind to want to meet with you and, and profit motive or, or monetary motive is off the table. It’s like, it’s not about money. And so, and that’s, that means it’s a different relationship. And it also means that you, because it’s not about any kind of money transaction, it’s a, long-term a much, much longer term opportunity.
[00:10:07] I mean, you know, I met with Ron since, 2010. If I was paying him monthly for his advice, I would not still be talking to him. I just know myself. I mean, I don’t want, I don’t think I would do that for. 1112 years. And so that, that, that’s the distinguishing characteristic in my mind between a local mentor, that you can find.
[00:10:27] And you should. And then coaches, which of course I’m not anti coach. I’m all, you know, I’m pro coach. I am a coach. But I do think that those are obvious differences that people should sort through and have both because the answer is both in. Yeah,
[00:10:41] Michael: exactly. Yeah. I totally agree. I think that, that actually, one thing we’ve got to give ourselves a break on is do you think about Charles education and how much money it takes to get people to pretty basic abilities and like people when the adult learners of the piano and then adult learns the business, always paranoid about the fact that children learn incredibly quickly, my experience of going to teaching in the past.
[00:11:02] No, that’s not true. They learn very slowly. They learn their ABCs and that alphabets pretty slowly, they learn to speak slowly. They learn to walk slowly and they learned to do any skills like playing the piano or riding a bike or running up mass slowly. But we pour as parents and teachers pour money and time and effort because we know the payoff will be big.
[00:11:21] And I think we need to give ourselves the same grace that. It is going to take money and effort. Sometimes it’s paid, sometimes it’s different. It’s developing relationships, having the courage to talk to a mentor. There’s always some kind of cost and, and we need to have multiple people helping us. And we need that over time.
[00:11:37] I think this is the reality to try and starve ourselves of that is to do ourselves a disservice as business people. I think it’s just not, it’s not mentally possible to survive in a vacuum. I think somehow, you know, Mike might say, so what’s your next insights. Okay.
[00:11:51] Jason: Yeah. The next one is as a follow on if you will.
[00:11:54] But, it is an interesting insight that, there are, I guess I didn’t, I guess I didn’t really honestly know this, but there are really vast differences between people who. We’ll support you in terms of your tax filing and your tax situation and in the U S you know, everybody knows go find a CPA certified public accountant.
[00:12:18] You want somebody that has that credential, in the UK it’s chartered accountant, I think is the phrase. And so we all know that, but the quality of what you get from those people is a massive spectrum that I honestly didn’t quite understand because, and I’ll describe it this way. When we found our CPA, he always spoke into our business in terms of optimizing for tax efficiency and profitable.
[00:12:46] And would just answer every question we had and we had questions and he would take the time with us as a part of the process of doing our filings. And then, and then we started meeting with him more than once a year, because it was just, it was so much, you know, learning and insight and he was ready, willing, and able to speak into our business.
[00:13:07] Other people have a very, very different experiences with their CPA or chartered accountant where it’s literally give me your numbers. Here’s what you pay the government, see you next year, or, you know, pay Becky at the front counter on your way out. That. Is very, I mean, that’s like shockingly different outcomes and results, I think.
[00:13:28] And so to me, I just wasn’t, I, you know, I’ve only had my own experience and I haven’t like shopped around and hopped around from one person in the next, in terms of having the CPA relationships. But I just realized through this, you know, effort and, and working through these topics, that, that is actually situations.
[00:13:44] People find themselves in where they have a marginal support or help from their CPA. And so I think the takeaway, the, the, the lesson is go find yourself a really good strategically minded and business minded CPA that ideally has e-commerce expertise that can help you, optimize for tax efficiency and business structure, legal structure, all of that, to really make sure that you’re optimized because, because failure to do that means that you’re missing out on huge opportunity.
[00:14:16] Yeah, or can, can be, you know,
[00:14:18] Michael: so I agree a lot with this. I would say, I mean, I like you, I had quite a lucky experience in the sense that I had, the first accounts that I’ve really worked with any seriousness on business really came from a coaching community, which is the same one that sort of pitched me into getting into Amazon Vajra court, by course.
[00:14:34] So, she had a background as a financial coach, as well as a CPA or chartered accountant, which I think is a critical distinction. I think I chose who I wasn’t partly luck. I chose it because I thought she would be that kind of person I was. Right. But I think that the distinction for me is you want something.
[00:14:51] Able to be a financial coach for you, as well as just doing your taxes. And it’s a little bit like a legal advisor. This is a lawyer. So for example, lawyers will help you with real estate transactions. We’ve recently remortgaged and property. We bought some a while ago. So property meaning real estate.
[00:15:04] It’s everyone at you guys use the word real estate, cause it means Royal and you don’t have royalty, but anyway, there’s a hangover from the British days. Yeah. I have no
[00:15:11] Jason: idea what you’re talking about, but that sounds very interesting. And you need to dive into that
[00:15:15] Michael: real estate anyway, property, real estate.
[00:15:17] So we bought some a while ago and our lawyer did a ton of work and they didn’t really advise us. And I think they just did a load of stuff that ticking legal boxes, right. Which is a different value. And I really think a great CPA. It’s really simple. They need to be good at taxes and they need to be good at explaining it, which is a whole as there’s two Venn diagrams that crossover to give quite a small percentage of the population of CPAs and you’ve found a good one.
[00:15:38] I did as well. And as you said, many don’t. So I think that’s the key. If somebody isn’t the advisor, as
[00:15:43] Jason: it is the key and it unlocks massive profitability. I in my view. And so I would just, if you find yourself in a situation where you’re really, really unhappy with your, tax, you know, preparing process or service or person you work with, shop around, ask for, ask for recommendations from other people, and really find somebody who you can lean into in terms of tapping their brain and expertise that a good CPA will work with, you know, dozens or hundreds or whatever of businesses that they can speak to your business from the, I guess, what you might call the advantage position of having seen so many other businesses, none of it’s confidential information that they’ll share.
[00:16:29] It’s just, Models and process and ideas. But it will be refined through the fire of hundreds and hundreds of business for, for, for years and years and years of, the journey. And that wisdom is synthesized so profoundly by those people. If they’ll share it with you, you will really accelerate your journey towards profitability.
[00:16:53] Yeah.
[00:16:54] Michael: I agree entirely with that now. The next point that you, that you had to do with, was really to do with, you know, unlocking that knowledge that CPA’s, or, or fi you know, financial specialists can have. So what, what’s that insane?
[00:17:07] Jason: Yeah. The final one on our list here is I think what I’ve realized as people frequently don’t even know the questions to ask.
[00:17:18] To help unlock profitability in their business, or don’t have, the, the formulation of kind of the areas of business that really poke into and probe into, in a way that unlocks lessons and specific tactics or strategies. And I’m not saying that to be kind of a judgmental, but I, it just strikes me that a good question is the foundation of change in your business, right?
[00:17:46] And migrating from less profitable to more profitable in your business and those sets of questions around all the different various types or, or aspects of your business, from, staffing to facilities, to, marketing and advertising costs to, inventory management, inventory payment, to, you know, tax and legal structure, international structures, and on and on.
[00:18:12] I mean, there’s, there’s so many areas that impact your profitability and having, insight into how to approach those and even ask questions, I think is a foundation. I would love a book to be honest. And I’ve started to think about this. Give me just give me a book of a hundred amazing questions to ask my CPA.
[00:18:31] That would be a great book. What am I supposed to ask about this topic or that topic? Or because just seeing the question and be like, oh yeah, that’s a thing. Oh, okay. And it, you know, it’s hard for me to like, I mean, I can’t do it in this podcast, but list all of the questions that are relevant, but you get the idea that in every one of these business categories, there are ways you can run profitably and ways you can waste money and you know, no one intentionally waste money, only a math sickest, and intentionally waste money in their business.
[00:19:05] Nobody does that. You accidentally waste money and you don’t uncover that unless you have the ability to ask questions and probe into it. So I think that was an interesting takeaway. And, and I, it just spurs me on to want to do more work for our community and to really research more myself and, and put things out in terms of content and maybe books or whatever, to really help people get after this stuff, in a professional.
[00:19:33] Work a day, Tradecraft level, non shiny object, non salesy way. Like, this is just as just yeoman’s type work, like show up and like start, you know, using the tools in your toolbox to sort it out. And, I think there’s a lot of opportunity there for us as coaches, business leaders and, and teachers to. To help people, you know, a hundred
[00:19:56] Michael: percent, I, by the way, I’ve been thinking very similar lines myself.
[00:19:59] I mean, I don’t think it’s been because I mean, you and I have discussed profits every so often, but we’ve discussed a lot of things, but I think I’ve been just coming to more and more of the same conclusion, myself looking at my client’s businesses, thinking there’s so much opportunity here, but there’s so much waste and I’m not equipped on my own to do this, but I know some amazing accountants and specialists and I want to kind of put together a structure that makes sense.
[00:20:20] I’ve got the pieces of it and I’m feeling the same and it’s going to be harder to sell because it’s not a shiny object. But what I do think is it kind of is I think it’s a perception thing too, to the point that the overall theme that’s emerging for me from this, this podcast is. That’s about mentality that there seems to be this thought that, you know, whatever it is, Facebook marketing, retargeting, the latest Amazon ads platform, any objects?
[00:20:43] Yeah. Yeah. All the effort going to do what they’re going to drive revenue and that’s going to blow your business up. Well, what do you mean by blow your business revenue? Isn’t your money, but if you think I could sell my business, there’s actual real money in your pocket. Multiple ones of my friends do this with Amazon businesses and we’ll continue to see it.
[00:20:59] I’m sure actually, a million pounds of cash coming into your whole bank. That’s real money. That’s not theory. That’s not something made up by an accountant. That’s an enterprise value. In other words, you’ve sold the business for X. That is a reflection profit times, multiple that’s real money. And if we can get excited about the profit number going up and the defensibility going up, meaning actual money in your account, that’s when it’s a shiny object, actually.
[00:21:21] And I think weirdly the closest we’re getting to shiny objects. Profitability is aggregators. Everyone’s already talking about them in the Amazon space. And then people are aware of it’s a multiple of X. And then they’re really thinking about their bottom line and taking that number more seriously than they used to.
[00:21:34] I think that’s actually a healthy development on the back of something, which is like anything else, maybe too much of a bubble than a trend, but yeah. The thing, I would say with a CPA, my experiences to ask some simple questions. I mean, first of all, as a CEO, if you’re setting strategic goals for your business, how does this help get me there?
[00:21:51] Or is this getting in the way? But another way is to just stand back and exactly what you said, they’ve, they’ve had the luxury of insight. Well, the luxury they’ve had the fire of insight into hundreds of small businesses and their experience, and just say, okay, in this kind of business model, what are the opportunities and threats you see?
[00:22:09] What, what do you typically see as being an opportunity, which we could take advantage of and what typically brings down a business like this, and then let them give them their insights. Because that’s quite a broad question. They’re probably very well-equipped to answer because of the patterns that emerge after hundreds and hundreds of such consultations, you know?
[00:22:26] Yeah,
[00:22:27] Jason: totally agree. All right, man. Well, that’s the list. And really, really hope that it’s, sparked some interest in. Insight into how to go forward successfully towards profitability. And I would just encourage everybody. It’s a perfect time of year as we’re recording this it’s the end of the year.
[00:22:44] It might be live on our, on our show on, you know, early in the new year. But nonetheless, whenever you’re hearing it, it’s, it’s always a perfect time, I guess, to think about what’s the profitability level in your business and what are your systems and processes set up to clearly show you and what opportunities exist.
[00:23:02] And so, yeah, I just hope that people really take the time to think through this. The biggest, the biggest, worry that I would have a regret that I would hate to see people make is to have sold millions in their business and then look back and realize they could have been much, much more. Twice as profitable three times, the more profitable, you know, they could have, they could have had so much more profit from the effort.
[00:23:30] And to me, it’s almost like a stewardship thing as, as I think about it as like, you know, it’s, it’s not actually about the, the specific number it’s just about stewarding the, the engine that you’ve built and really getting optimal, you know, horsepower out of it or mileage or whatever your metric is for, for profit.
[00:23:48] And that’s my hope for everybody is that you take this insight from this conversation and, you know, we don’t even have the profit habits, content available. Now, the workshop’s over, I think we’ll make it evergreen version of it, but there are 17 habits that we worked through. There are key insights for all of them that help unlock, you know, information for us as operators.
[00:24:05] So that’s my hope with all of this is that people just get better and better at managing their, their, their, their business and, and see it change their life and change their family and change their community and, you know, and, and really change the world because businesses can change the world and, Yeah,
[00:24:22] Michael: I think that’s a great ambition.
[00:24:23] I also think, sort of seriously in the end, you’ve built, I was just thinking my metaphor Springs to mind is those giant, American cars with like seven liter engines or whatever you guys measuring cubic inches or something versus a formula one car formula. One car is limited to about a two liter engine, but they, they scream along at like 20,000 breaths per minute and producing credible amount of power and speed.
[00:24:44] So that’s for me, like an incredibly, highly tuned business that spits out profit, like crazy versus a big lumbering business that is producing a lot of revenue, but it’s very, very wasteful and inefficient in. Then I think that
[00:24:58] Jason: metaphor engine versus Dodge trucks.
[00:25:03] Michael: Yeah. I mean nothing against the Dodge truck, but the thing is to not devaluate that at that moment, either than could be the perfect vehicle for you.
[00:25:10] But the point is to not. Just see the size of the engineer, that’s it? That is not the end of how an engine works. And then you, me, one engineer will tell you it’s a lot harder to engineer, but there’s a beautiful, incredible thing. So there you go. It’s engineering, engineering’s financial reengineering is whether those words people use.
[00:25:25] And I think that’s an exciting thing. So there you go. A formula one car is a metaphor, maybe a bit sexier as a shiny objects go. Would you mind just summarizing those, those, I think it’s seven sort of takeaways that you had. So what, what
[00:25:37] Jason: are your thoughts? Yeah. In summary, people are jaded when it comes to the topic of finance and profitability, defense.
[00:25:44] Untrusting, maybe burned out, maybe feeling burned. And we all need to think about our psychology and whether we have those negative sentiments that we bring to the party and don’t approach it. Open-handed. And with a positive frame of mind, second takeaway is many people would avoid the topic if they could and would prefer to avoid it until crisis happens.
[00:26:06] A third insight is, people come to the realization that profit as the focus is central over time. And the first focus is always top-line sales, which is fine, but the maturing business owner realizes that profitability is key. The fourth big takeaway is that the single biggest mistake we see people make is not investing in profit focused education and learning more, for their own management ability in their business.
[00:26:34] The fifth takeaway is getting an informal mentor locally that you can meet with sixth takeaway is getting a really good CPA that adds value and strategic insight for business efficiency, operations, and tax, you know, efficiency as well. And then the, the seventh takeaway is all of us need to get better.
[00:26:56] Figuring out what questions to ask of our bookkeeper or CPA and ourselves about how to unlock profitability in our business. And I think if we do these things and we focus on them, we’re going to be better off in this coming year. So there you have it, that’s the summary
[00:27:11] Michael: like it does Chuck into formula one business.
[00:27:15] That was, sounds like a very old ambition, but you get the idea. So you have, I believe, a sort of virtual CFO services come off the back of some of these profit habits. Where is that available to the general public or is that only for your members? Or how does that work?
[00:27:28] Jason: Yeah, no, actually, Zack Martin is the one who helped co-teach the, uh, uh, the workshop.
[00:27:33] He’s a CPA with all the background and in consulting, he is doing some, Slots of time with us now going forward every week as basically a virtual CFO, in, in people’s businesses. So Kyle and I focus on Shopify. I focused on Shopify focus is on Amazon with people and Zach now is coming alongside, some coaching clients.
[00:27:53] He only has a limited number of slots and we’re basically bolting him into, or that service into our, consultancy. And so if that’s of interest, you could hit us up on winning on shopify.com. That’s our best current site to use in terms of contact form. Okay. We can talk to you more about that, but it’s really a pretty short list of, hours.
[00:28:13] He has to be honest. And, but, but we’ll, we’ll relaunch the profit habits workshop again in the spring, and probably make an evergreen version of it. So that would be the other takeaway for going. Yep. I like
[00:28:24] Michael: it by the way, just as a sort of backup to the health, really the importance of getting a virtual or fractional CFO.
[00:28:30] I spoke to Jim Mann. Who’s a friend of mine for several years, British Amazon’s for the other. I think he sold a seven figure business a while ago, and he works with Russia these days. And he said the two big takeaways for him were supplier credit is an incredible thing. Utilize that to the max. That’s the sort of technical hint if you’d like, but the other thing is get a fractional CFO incredibly important in his view.
[00:28:49] So there you go. So if you want to build a business that will be acquired by the biggest, PE guys in this space, I think to date they’ve raised $4 billion or something close to that. By the time you hear it, it’ll be update because they keep raising more money and those guys take that seriously. So that’s a good hint that you really should.
[00:29:04] Take that series to, I think that’s an amazing opportunity.
[00:29:07] Jason: A virtual CFO, I guess, fractional CFO is the phrase and
[00:29:12] Michael: virtualize the poses, both. In other words, like you get an insight for one hour a week as opposed to somebody 40 hours a week dedicated to your business or whatever the, the, the, the method or the rhythm is.
[00:29:21] I, I, I can’t stress enough. I, I think that could be the biggest game changer for most people out there. I mean, they’re obsessed with marketing already, cause that’s what we all obsessed with to get marketed to. Right. It, I can’t, I can’t stress enough how important I think that is. And it’s not just my idea.
[00:29:34] It’s the biggest acquisition guys in the space,
[00:29:38] Jason: huge value. And I think the reason he said that is because if he’s being. Generous to the people who were listening to that comment. Then what he’s saying is optimize your profitability and you’ll optimize your business value and you’ll optimize your exit.
[00:29:53] You know, have a million dollar business that makes zero profit and see how much people are going to offer you for it. Yeah.
[00:29:58] Michael: Well, another way of putting it is it is not a million dollar business, if you you’re measuring stuff by revenue, but in terms of enterprise value, it is zero. The enterprise value of a business though profit is zero.
[00:30:08] Exactly. Right? So there’s another way of putting it. The final thing to say is as ever face, if you’re enjoying this show and don’t forget to rate the podcast on apple iTunes or apple podcasts and subscribe on your podcast player of choice, I’m, I’m just very nice to see on Spotify that our subscribers or followers are growing pretty steadily.
[00:30:25] I have to say that they’ve been growing pretty.
[00:30:28] Jason: Well, I’ve been telling the audience here that we’re number one. E-commerce show on Spotify when you put a dash between the E and the C for e-commerce and, but it’s blown up, man. And, some, I think we’re number one for no dash between the a and the C as well.
[00:30:43] When you search for e-commerce, at least that’s what happens when I’ve seen people do it and I’ve done it in Spotify. I don’t know how rigged those, customized results are when you search for items. But nonetheless, we’re having a great turnout in Spotify, and it’s an honor, if you’re watching or listening on Spotify, be sure to, do whatever you can to like the show, give it a heart, I think, and that puts it into your favorites or something like that.
[00:31:05] So thank you everybody. Who’s checking us out on Spotify. Really appreciate
[00:31:08] Michael: it. Absolutely. You are. It’s been a great show. Thanks for sharing some very interesting psychology of profits. I think that’s quite an interesting topic. Interesting discussion.
[00:31:19] Jason: All right, everybody. Thanks
[00:31:20]